Avagene Moore: Welcome to the EIIP Virtual Forum! Amy Sebring, my associate, and I are delighted to see each of you here today. Please note that Lori Wieber is also with us - Lori helps us with each session and we do appreciate her as well. Avagene Moore: Our subject today is the 2007 Discussion Draft of the "National Flood Programs and Policies in Review" by the Association of State Floodplain Managers (ASFPM). Avagene Moore: Some of you may be following the House Financial Services Committee at this time. This past Monday, the Committee Chair unveiled legislation to revamp the federal government's flood insurance program which is now a 38-year old program. This is the type of thing the ASFPM monitors. Avagene Moore: Before we get into our presentation, the order for today is an introduction of our speaker, the formal presentation, and then the Q&A segment of our hour when you can direct your questions one at a time to our speaker. Avagene Moore: Please do not send Direct Messages to the speaker or moderator during the presentation. It is very distracting while we are trying to keep order and conduct a smooth, professional session. If you have a problem, please send a private message to Amy. Avagene Moore: A transcript of today's Forum will be available later this afternoon. Avagene Moore: After the formal part of today's session, I will give instructions for an orderly Q&A segment. Please watch for those and abide by them when we are ready for your questions and comments. Avagene Moore: We are very pleased to introduce our speaker today. Pam Pogue is the current ASFPM Chair and State NFIP Manager for the State of Rhode Island. Ms. Pogue has been involved in multi-disaster natural hazard mitigation, coastal zone management and watershed management programs, policies and issues since 1987. Avagene Moore: In June 2005, she was elected Chair of the Association of State Floodplain Managers (ASFPM), an organization of professionals involved in floodplain management, flood hazard mitigation, the NFIP, and flood preparedness, warning and recovery. Avagene Moore: Please take the time to read Pam's bio and links to related materials on the background page after our session. Avagene Moore: Please help me welcome Pam Pogue to the EIIP Virtual Forum! Thanks for being here today, Pam. I now turn the floor to you. Pam Pogue: Thank you for inviting me here today. It is good to see each of you in the Virtual Forum. I am here to discuss the ASFPM 2007 draft, National Flood Programs and Policies in Review. Before we get started, I would like to tell you about the Association of State Floodplain Managers (ASFPM) that began in 1977. The ASFPM represents the professionals involved in floodplain management, flood hazard mitigation, flood preparedness, and flood warning and recovery. Pam Pogue: It is the mission of the Association to mitigate the losses, costs and human suffering caused by flooding and to promote wise use of the natural and beneficial functions of floodplains. Today the ASFPM is the premier voice in floodplain management practice and policy throughout the nation. Pam Pogue: Our 6,500 national and chapter members represent local, state and federal government agencies, citizen groups, private consulting firms, academia, the insurance industry, and lenders. ASFPM's influence is expressed through policy and practice changes that impact floodplain management in the U.S. and internationally. Our goals are simple -- help the public and private sectors: Pam Pogue: Reduce the loss of human life and property damage resulting from flooding. - Preserve the natural and cultural values of floodplains. - Promote flood mitigation for the prevention of loss and the wise use of floodplains. Pam Pogue: The ASFPM believes the opportunity to provide protection for our citizens and businesses has never been greater. We must begin to make use of our floodplains in ways that are not only ecologically correct, but are acceptable to our society as a whole. Wise floodplain management will provide both the means to address our flooding problems as well as creating sustainable development for future generations. Pam Pogue: ASFPM is committed to working with local and state governments, federal agencies, the insurance and development industries, Congress, research and academia colleagues, our numerous partners in the private and public sectors, ... and other professionals in floodplain management as well as related fields in the U.S. and abroad. We invite all who are dedicated to the future well being of this nation to join us in working toward reduced overall flood losses and the wise use of our lands. Pam Pogue: You may be wondering about the background of the document under consideration. Seven years ago the ASFPM published National Flood Programs in Review 2000, the ASFPM's periodic review of national floodplain management policy. Pam Pogue: While there was much work to be done in flood policy, the tone of that document was quite upbeat. Nonstructural flood protection measures and funding of mitigation programs was a mainstream thought. Integration of programs of flood and environmental management appeared to be moving forward. Pam Pogue: In 2007 there are many good things happening. Under the surface there is some retreat from the gains of the 1990s, while on the other hand there are advances being made in other areas. This may be the natural ebb and flow of policy and in 25-years what today may appear a threatening trend may simply be looked back upon as one point in a seamless continuance and evolution of a comprehensive policy line. Pam Pogue: Perhaps the closest the nation has come is with Executive Order 11988 signed in 1977 by President Carter. Beyond that Executive Order, whether it is the National Flood Insurance Program (NFIP), the Natural Resources Conservation Service's Small Watershed Program, coastal zone management under the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, ... Pam Pogue: flood protection projects of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, the wetland and watershed programs of the Environmental Protection Agency, development and redevelopment program of the Department of Housing and Urban Development, or a variety of other initiatives--all mirrored and implemented by state and local governments--we continue to deal with floodplain management through programmatic stove pipes. Pam Pogue: These are some of the significant events (or perhaps non-events) that have transpired since 2000 and are influencing flood policy today: Pam Pogue: The ASFPM believes the solution to escalating flood damage and loss of floodplain resources is a coordinated national policy, with a transfer of assumed responsibility from the federal government to the local and state levels. Today some federal programs are being modified in a manner ... Pam Pogue: that ignores the state role, or are being set up to provide direct services to local governments with little thought of establishing incentives to build capability or encourage responsibility. As pointed out in this document, state-level capability is diminishing, and local capability is inconsistent and limited. Losses from floods cannot be reduced if these trends are left unchecked. Pam Pogue: Although many advances have been made, the ASFPM is concerned that if we do not renew our efforts to institutionalize coordination among all levels of government and to solidify local and state capability, then the hard-won advances in the field of floodplain management will be lost rapidly. In that event, the cost to the nation will be extreme, as demonstrated by the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina. Pam Pogue: Having said all of the above - why is this document offered and why is it important at this time? This document, National Flood Programs and Policies in Review 2007, is the ASFPM's vehicle for commenting on and providing a comprehensive (and perhaps the only current) record of changes in U.S. floodplain management policy. Pam Pogue: The appraisals and recommendations in this report represent the cumulative experiences of floodplain managers nationwide. As the nation's leading organized voice for floodplain management, the ASFPM offers this status report of important adjustments needed in national flood protection programs and policy for the near future. Pam Pogue: This discussion draft is being provided to the ASFPM membership and the public to facilitate timely access to ASFPM positions, findings, or floodplain management techniques, and to stimulate discussion that may result in refinement of the draft's content. Pam Pogue: Comments are welcome and should be sent to the ASFPM Executive Office at asfpm@floods.org. The final report will be available through the ASFPM in 2007 and will be announced in the ASFPM's newsletter, News & Views, when it is published Pam Pogue: In closing, you are encouraged to read the draft document, study the recommendations and comment as you see fit. Please look for additional information including the ASFPM membership application on our website at www.floods.org. That's where you will also find the goals, activities and accomplishments of our 12 policy committees who orchestrate the bulk of our national flood policy work. Pam Pogue: The ASFPM invites each of you to participate in the following conferences as well: The Association of State Floodplain Managers will convene our 31st annual gathering -- the world's largest and most comprehensive floodplain management conference -- the week of June 3-8, 2007, in Norfolk, Virginia. Pam Pogue: If it is appropriate at this time Avagene, I am ready to take any questions or comments. Avagene Moore: Thank you for a fine presentation, Pam. I am sure our audience has questions. Avagene Moore: Our protocol for asking a question or making a comment is to input a question mark (?) to the screen. Once you have sent your ? forward, please start composing your question and have it ready when I call upon you by name. I will call upon you in the order of the names as they appear on the screen. Avagene Moore: Please submit one question at a time. If you have another question, get back in line and we will get to you. Avagene Moore: Please input your ? at any time. We are ready to begin our Q&A. Amy Sebring: ? Avagene Moore: Yes, Amy, when you are ready. Amy Sebring: Pam, do you have any target date for the final draft, and then will you submit to Congress? Pam Pogue: Amy, our target date is beginning of June as we plan to distribute the document and have a presentation on it at our annual conference. Avagene Moore: Other questions, please. Don't be shy. Avagene Moore: ? Pam Pogue: We will also have it available on the ASFPM website www.floods.org Avagene Moore: Pam, you mentioned diminished and limited capability at state and local levels. How will policy influence that? How is the ASFPM organized to foster more state and local involvement and action? Pam Pogue: Great question Avagene... Pam Pogue: ASFPM has 25 (hopefully soon to be 28) state chapters... Ray Melberg: ? Pam Pogue: I am hoping that there will be much information disseminated thorough the chapters... Pam Pogue: Such as working with other state partners such as the environmental management agencies, Coastal Zone agencies etc. on common issues. Avagene Moore: Ray, your question, please. Ray Melberg: Are there any concerns about earthquake vulnerability of dams in watershed areas like California John Boyle: ? Pam Pogue: There are certainly concerns, seismic risk is a critical issue... Pam Pogue: As far as this document, we would advocate future planning and risk management. Avagene Moore: John, you are next, sir. John Boyle: You mentioned the stovepipe issue, which is a problem in government today. can you give a sense of how this will be addressed? Pam Pogue: John, can you be more specific, perhaps as it might relate to a particular program? Pam Pogue: If I may use a coastal example re "stovepiping"... John Boyle: You mentioned that each agency such as USACE etc. has their own process/policy. How might they proposed document change this to bring them together? Pam Pogue: In Rhode Island we try to address the issue of coastal flooding, impacts from hurricanes, etc. by working with our state coastal agency to leverage resources and expertise on the establishment of Special Area Management Plans. John Boyle: ? Avagene Moore: Go ahead, John John Boyle: Yes, coastal is a great example. There are 4 or 5 agencies involved in coastal management and each has their own plan. Amy Sebring: ? Pam Pogue: As far as the Corps--we would advocate more resources be brought to Corps programs such as Floodplain Management Service and Planning Assistance to states to address the technical and planning aspects of state flood issues. Avagene Moore: Does that answer your question, John? John Boyle: Yes, I spent time in LA . . . the USACE needs to address coastal restoration. Avagene Moore: Thanks. Amy, next, please. Amy Sebring: I have a follow up to John's question perhaps. Is there a specific report recommendation to enhance interagency coordination generally? Pam Pogue: Yes there is with examples and how federal agencies can better collaborate... Pam Pogue: We also plan to publish a very detailed matrix that cross-references all of the recommendations given to each subject area, as well as agency jurisdiction. Avagene Moore: ? (Anyone with a question, please put in your ? at any time.) Avagene Moore: Pam, can you share a brief overview of ASFPM's position on levees? I ask because of the spotlight on levees in the New Orleans area. Pam Pogue: Sure... Avagene Moore: Recommendations would have been a better word. Pam Pogue: First, please see our website at www.floods.org as we have posted a paper on the levee issue with a set of recommendations. Pam Pogue: I believe that essentially ASFPM's position is that the maintenance of levees is a state responsibility. Avagene Moore: Other questions, anyone? Amy Sebring: ? Barbara Nelson: ? Avagene Moore: Amy, please, when you are ready. Amy Sebring: I think in your introduction you were generally alluding to the decline in the emphasis on mitigation in recent years .... Avagene Moore: ? Amy Sebring: do you think this may turn around? For example in the PDM program... Barbara Nelson: What about the difficulties of addressing the needs of the local communities for economic development and flood plain development issues? Amy Sebring: I am not sure we even have a way to capture nationally what the mitigation needs are in a quantitative way? Avagene Moore: Wait a minute, Barbara. We are in the middle of another question. Amy Sebring: I am referring again to stovepiping of programs. Pam Pogue: Amy would you mind restating your question? Amy Sebring: Do you see any signs post-Katrina of more receptiveness to flood mitigation? Pam Pogue: Absolutely!... Ray Melberg: ? Pam Pogue: I see it not just in the Gulf area, which is critical... Ray Melberg: Properties that suffer repeated flooding but generally pay subsidized flood insurance rates--so-called repetitive-loss properties-- constitute a significant drain on NFIP resources. These properties account for roughly 1 percent of properties insured under the NFIP, but account for 25 percent to 30 percent of all claim losses. Pam Pogue: post-Katrina I see other states addressing flood issues in a much more progressive manner... Kevin Houck: Can you give some examples of what other states are doing? Pam Pogue: For example, I will bet that until recently, most states did not even know they had levees, or what one was. Pam Pogue: Ray addressing our question first about rep loss properties... Avagene Moore: Folks, you have to get in line with your questions. Put in a ? if you have a question. Barbara, can you please restate your question? Barbara Nelson: Conflicts actually is a better word. Small cities that need an economic base are allowing development in the flood plain, which increases the intensity of the floods--what are some options? Pam Pogue: As you may know there is a FEMA repetitive loss pilot program...are you aware of that? It was a result of the 2004 NFIP reform legislation. Amy Sebring: ? Pam Pogue: Not sure what you are asking Ray, but yes there has been emphasis placed on repetitive loss properties. Avagene Moore: Barbara has a question for you, Pam. Please see it above. Pam Pogue: My questions would first be--are these small cities in the NFIP? Barbara Nelson: yes Pam Pogue: If they are, then through implementing the NFIP building requirements (not the strongest but what we have better than nothing)... John Boyle: ? Pam Pogue: There should not be the extensive development occurring in the floodplain as you refer to. Avagene Moore: Dam safety is also in the news, Pam. We have one dam in Tennessee that has received a great deal of publicity - the Wolfe Creek Dam. Does the discussion draft address recommendations re: dam safety? If so, can you briefly discuss them? Pam Pogue: Re dam safety Avagene, yes the report covers that... Pam Pogue: back to stovepiping, we would advocate that dam safety program be working in concert with the floodplain management program... Kevin Houck: ? Pam Pogue: For example, dam inundation mapping should be done (NRCS, Corps, USGS) with the floodplain management program to identify areas, properties at risk... Pam Pogue: Also, flood warning should be coordinated through a statewide stream gage network (USGS) with the flood folks and emergency management folks to prepare (FEMA, NFIP, National Weather Service) for example. Avagene Moore: John, your question, please. John Boyle: Does the report stress the importance of breaking down the barriers between local planning and zoning/community development departments and flood plain protection? Pam Pogue: Great question John!... Pam Pogue: Yes, as a matter of fact, the report emphasizes the critical role of land use planning and future development planning in terms of negating future impacts from flooding... Pam Pogue: accomplished through collaborative efforts with other state agencies and local government that makes the land use decisions. Avagene Moore: Amy, please. Amy Sebring: It seems clear to me post-Katrina that there still is a great deal of confusion in the minds of the public as to what is and what is not covered by homeowners insurance or the need for flood insurance. Does ASFPM encourage public education on this issue specifically? (Apparently the recently introduced legislation is going to include some requirements in this area.) Pam Pogue: Yes! I get calls each week as to what flood insurance covers and who can buy it.. Pam Pogue: The 2004 NFIP reform mandated that each state train their insurance agents. Pam Pogue: There is a very effective FEMA initiative, FLOODSMART, which is a great way to get the word out ... Pam Pogue: check out the web site at www.FLOODSMART.gov. It will indicate once you have entered an address what your flood risk is and how to buy insurance. Avagene Moore: Kevin is back, good! Kevin, you have a question for Pam? Amy Sebring: ? Avagene Moore: Amy, please. We will come back to Kevin. Kevin Houck: Sorry, I lost my connection...Pam, it seems like in past versions of the document, the focus has been on coastal areas. Does this version of the document address the quickly growing western areas of the country? Pam Pogue: Yes...great question... Pam Pogue: What is very helpful in this version, and I think makes it such a strong document with wide appeal, ... Pam Pogue: is that it addresses "special flood hazards" such as those in coastal areas and the arid regions in our country. Avagene Moore: Now, Amy. Amy Sebring: Has ASFPM ever done a survey to find out how many cities/counties have a full time certified flood plain manager? This staff cost is totally borne by the local jurisdictions is it not? That is, there is no grant money for this? (This goes to the issue of local capacity.) Avagene Moore: ? Pam Pogue: Actually Amy, ASFPM did complete a doc called "Effective Management Program... Pam Pogue: It is on the website and includes all of the information you are asking about. With regard to the actual number of CFMs... Pam Pogue: There is a running count by ASFPM as to how many are in each state and I will also add... Pam Pogue: that the FEMA base funding program for the NFIP -- Community Asistance Program --State Support Services Element (CAPSSE) does allow Pam Pogue: for CFM prep and exam to be covered in the annual grant. Amy Sebring: But does not support salaries? Amy Sebring: Am I correct on that issue? Pam Pogue: Wow , now there is a sore point... Pam Pogue: Let me explain... Avagene Moore: If you have a question for Pam, please input your ? now. We have time for a few more questions. Pam Pogue: The CAPSSE covers SOME of the expenses in implementing the State NFIP... Pam Pogue: However it is a 75/25 match, so it is also incumbent on the state to support it as well, as they should. Avagene Moore: Pam, twenty years ago, there was more cooperation between National EM associations and the ASFPM than I am aware of these days. Also, I don't know that anyone in my community is working on floodplain management. I have always thought that EM and floodplain issues should go hand and hand and the two disciplines should cooperate, collaborate, etc. Any thoughts on that? Pam Pogue: Sure, I was the State Hazard Mitigation Officer for several years. The SHMO is responsible for EM activities... Pam Pogue: Prior to 9-1-1 there was a much stronger integration between floodplain management and emergency management. Avagene Moore: Thanks, Pam. Any other questions for Pam? Amy Sebring: ? Avagene Moore: Yes, Amy. Pam Pogue: As a result of the overemphasis (my opinion) on terrorism, huge amounts of resources (both $$$ and staff) were lost in FEMA ... Pam Pogue: I do believe that particularly as FEMA gets reassembled, we are slowly gaining ground. Amy Sebring: I have a final general question regarding ASFPM. Pam does ASFPM participate in these issues on the international level at all? With Canada or Europe, for example? Kevin Houck: ? Pam Pogue: Yes we do... last year I was asked to present in Paris at the National Academies... Pam Pogue: The NA was very interested in Lessons Learned from Katrina... Pam Pogue: To me, what was most interesting was the very different mind set of the European in terms of being prepared. Avagene Moore: Kevin, please. Amy Sebring: Better? (The Netherlands comes to mind.) Kevin Houck: Thank you for everything that ASFPM is doing to push this national policy. What can we as individuals do to help support this? Pam Pogue: No, just more willing to take on personal responsibility rather than expecting the Federal handout. Avagene Moore: Hallelujah to that! Avagene Moore: Please take Kevin's question. Pam Pogue: As individuals we need to take on greater responsibility to educate and prepare, rather than complain that we are "getting more." Pam Pogue: It really aggravates me when I speak to folks over the phone that complain about $280.00 - $410.00 annual policies for up to $150,000 of coverage. Where else do you get a return like that? Avagene Moore: Kevin asks for all of us --- What can we as individuals do to help support this? Pam Pogue: Are you referring to reduction in flood loss or the ASFPM doc? Amy Sebring: ? Avagene Moore: I assume the document but Kevin can comment. Kevin Houck: I meant flood loss, but perhaps both... Pam Pogue: Buy flood insurance, educate/talk to your legislators and insurance agents! They really need to be educated. Avagene Moore: Amy, last question, please. Amy Sebring: Comment relating to insurance premiums. I believe the public at large is also ignorant of the Community Rating System, which can reduce their premiums if their community participates to achieve a higher rating .... Amy Sebring: I think there should be some national education done on this as well. Pam Pogue: Amy, you are right, CRS is a great opportunity. Avagene Moore: That is all the time we have today. Thank you, Pam, for your time and effort and for the good information! We certainly encourage folks to read the discussion draft and to provide comment to the ASFPM. We commend the ASFPM and urge the group to keep up the good work! Avagene Moore: If I may before we close, if you would like to be alerted to future Virtual Forum topics and are not on the EIIP Mail List, please subscribe by going to the EIIP Virtual Forum homepage. If interested in partnering with the EIIP, please see the "Partnership for You" link. Pam Pogue: Thank you everyone--sorry for the typos. Avagene Moore: Again, the transcript of today's session will be available later this afternoon and a notice will go to our Mail List when it is posted. Avagene Moore: Please join us next time, Wednesday, April 11. Before we sign off, please help me thank our speaker, Pam Pogue, for her presentation. And thanks to you, the audience, for your presence and participation. The EIIP Virtual Forum is adjourned!