01:01:01 PM Avagene Moore:Welcome to the Virtual Forum and the Round Table discussion! 01:01:12 PM Avagene Moore:We are pleased to have Dolores (Dee) Beaugez, MA, Publisher of the Horse View and President of Visual Imagry, Inc. with us today. ... 01:01:22 PM Avagene Moore:Dee also serves as creative Services Director for Visual Imagry, Inc. where she uses her experience in Web Page Design, TV / Video directing and strategic planning. ... 01:01:32 PM Avagene Moore:Dee has 15 years of successful and progressive experience in public relations, management, retail marketing and media relations. ... 01:01:41 PM Avagene Moore:Among other interests, Dee agressively promotes disaster planning for animals through her online publication, The Horse Review http://www.horsereview.com --- Dee has agreed to discuss this topic with us today. ... 01:01:54 PM Avagene Moore:Personally, I believe it is time for more awareness about the problems and plights of animals in disaster situations. Awareness for the individual pet owner, animal-care industries and those who do the community emergency plans. ... 01:02:04 PM Avagene Moore:After our formal questions of Dee, we will open the floor for Q&A with the audience. Instructions will be given prior to the Q&A. ... 01:02:19 PM Avagene Moore:Thanks for your willingness to participate in the Round Table, Dee. ... 01:02:28 PM Avagene Moore:And now for my first question: Dee, why or how did you get involved in disaster planning for animals? 01:02:42 PM Dolores D:I am very honored to be part of this group 01:03:49 PM Dolores D:There are emotional and non-emotional reasons. On the personal side - I've lived through three flash floods and made a promise to myself to help others... 01:04:18 PM Dolores D:Today I am the publsiher of The Horse Review, http://www.horsereview.com. As part of our mission statement we publish and post information about equine, large animal and pet disaster preparedness planning... 01:05:33 PM Dolores D:We have made a promise to continue our grass roots campaign to help individual prepare plans 01:05:57 PM Avagene Moore:Do you find a large number of people who share your concern for animals? 01:06:05 PM Dolores D:I find that 90% of the people we have met, interviewed, and talked with during the past year show a great concern for their animals and most consider them part of their family... 01:06:15 PM Dolores D:But what I find interesting is that most of those same people say they have no disaster preparedness plan in place. 01:06:24 PM Avagene Moore:In your opinion, is the emergency management community aware and receptive to disaster planning for animals? 01:06:37 PM Dolores D:Yes, according to the research we've done through The Horse Review, the 01:06:47 PM Dolores D:But in my opinion, there needs to be a national grass roots campaign 01:07:02 PM Avagene Moore:How do disasters affect animals and their owners? 01:07:02 PM Dolores D:I found that some national studies show that five percent (5%) or less 01:07:11 PM Dolores D:The vast majority of evacuees go to relatives, friends, motels, or 01:07:49 PM Dolores D:places of employment. It is my view that horse and large animals owners need to 01:07:56 PM Dolores D:their efforts into effective action, instead of risking everything by wallowing in 01:08:06 PM Dolores D:uncertainty. 01:08:26 PM Avagene Moore:Do you find more concern shown by pet owners or among livestock owners (animal-care industries such as cattle, horses, sheep, etc.) who have large investments in the animals in their care? 01:08:53 PM Dolores D:There is no easy answer. I feel that most pet owners are very concerned for their pets, but often do not have the information they need to prepare for or to assure the safety of their animals... 01:09:28 PM Dolores D:I've found that the majority of horse owners are also very concerned about the safety of their horses. However, by not having a disaster plan formulated, they are mostly ineffective in what limited efforts they use to try and save their horses. 01:09:32 PM Avagene Moore:Are there many communities incorporating animals into their disaster planning? 01:09:54 PM Dolores D:Yes, and we've identified there's a real need for networking so that 01:10:08 PM Dolores D:animal owners can become aware of their choices. 01:10:12 PM Avagene Moore:In your opinion, what can we do to make emergency managers and planners more aware of the need for disaster planning for animals? 01:10:29 PM Dolores D:Communication is the key that will open the door to change... 01:10:50 PM Dolores D:By making the public aware of the laws, facts, regulations, etc. individuals may take it upon themselves to better plan for the safety of 01:11:04 PM Dolores D:All too often people become victims because they do not understand what choices are available. 01:11:10 PM Avagene Moore:Can you list some good references that our audience can use to learn more and possibly help with awareness of animals in disasters? 01:11:34 PM Dolores D:Each week we post additional links from our web site at http://www.horsereview.com. These links include FEMA, the National Humane Society, the Humanitarian Resource Institute, managed by Stephen Apatow and others... 01:11:48 PM Dolores D:We also post press releases, personal stories in our "Each Horse Teaches Us" section, and memorials. 01:11:52 PM Avagene Moore:As far as your online publication, The Horse Review, what are your plans for further promotion of animal disaster planning? 01:12:04 PM Dolores D:We are gowing daily and plan to continue posting as much news and information as possible... 01:12:33 PM Dolores D:We have designed a questionnaire that we will begin distributing on Oct. 14, World Disaster Reduction Day. From the results of this survey, we hope to determine how many large animal (including horses) disaster plans have been written... 01:12:42 PM Dolores D:We are also in the process of writing and producing a series of songs about animals that have become heros during disasters. 01:12:51 PM Avagene Moore:Thank you, Dee, for the interview. As a reminder, if you have a question, please submit a question mark (?) and wait for recognition from the moderator before sending you question to the screen. ... 01:13:02 PM Avagene Moore:While waiting for recognition, you can compose your question for Dee. First question, please. 01:13:14 PM David Crews:EMI has just released a 2 Module Home Study on Animals in Disaster. The AVMA has also published a very comprehensive Emergency Preparedness and Response Guide in support of the Federal Response Plan (ESF-8). 01:13:16 PM Rick Tobin:? 01:13:24 PM Avagene Moore:Rick, go ahead. 01:13:47 PM Kevin Farrell:? 01:13:55 PM Rick Tobin:Are you aware of the work that the State of California is doing? It's quite extensive. 01:14:13 PM Joe Bills:This is Joe Bills of FEMA's Emergency Management Institute. For those of you who are not aware, we have just published a home study course entitled "Animals in Disaster." It serves to address this issue for emergency managers as well as individual pet owners as well as those of us who own horses and other large animals. For more information go to our web site at: http://www.fema.gov/emi.ishome.htm 01:14:54 PM Dolores D:Yes, we are working with Dr. Coli in Nevada who is working with UC Davis to help the City of Sparks with their Equine Disaster Preparedness Plan... 01:15:32 PM Dolores D:Joe, I'd like to add a link from our site is that possible? 01:15:48 PM Rick Tobin:After the floods of 1997 the Governor directed that the State Department of Food and Agriculture be the lead for all animal issues during disaster in California. A task force has just completed an umbrella for statewiede cooperation, and it will eventually work to the local government and NPO's. It uses the Florida and Indiana state models. 01:15:54 PM Joe Bills:Certainly, would love to have you do it! 01:16:03 PM Amy Sebring:(See also http://www.fema.gov/nwz98/98188.htm for article about the courses... 01:16:13 PM Amy Sebring:Joe is the course manager.) 01:16:29 PM Avagene Moore:Kevin, your question please. (Thanks to David Crews and Joe Bills for the good references.) 01:16:34 PM Kevin Farrell:Dee, Do you know of any jurisdictions that presently have a plan for animals... and do you know of any that have been tested? 01:16:45 PM Dolores D:Our publication is directed towards horse owners and we feel the message must reach the owners, as well as the planners. 01:17:12 PM Kevin Farrell:(besides CA which I just learned about :-) ) 01:17:34 PM Joe Bills:Flordia has a pretty good plan and it was tested during the fires in the early summer. 01:17:48 PM Dolores D:No, I do not, but may research is growing daily and we do not claim to be the expects, we have here to post the mesaage and provide a vehicle for information at no cost. 01:18:07 PM Avagene Moore:Other questions for Dee, please. 01:18:24 PM Amy Sebring:? 01:18:25 PM Avagene Moore:Dee, I have a question,,, 01:18:31 PM Dolores D:Yes, I have talked with Mike Steele from Sparks and we plan to order a copy. The cost is $100. 01:18:40 PM Avagene Moore:Go ahead Amy and I will go next. 01:18:45 PM Amy Sebring:I am about to leave you all to do a presentation to 80 4th graders ... 01:19:01 PM Amy Sebring:what should I tell them about small pets if they ask me? 01:19:28 PM Dolores D:The most important message is do not leave your pets... 01:20:17 PM Dolores D:But talk it over with your parents about what you need to care for the pet and ask thenm if they have talked about where they could stay with their pet (the family)... 01:20:26 PM Terry Storer:Have an ID picture and copies of health records in your family disaster kit. 01:21:04 PM Dolores D:The National Humane Society has a great page and you can access if off our site. I also have a link to FEMA for kids. 01:21:06 PM Rick Tobin:? 01:21:09 PM Avagene Moore:Dee, can you give us some idea of the percentage of animals, large and small, that are separated from their owners and possibly die in an average disaster? What happens to these animals if no one reclaims them? 01:21:40 PM Avagene Moore:(those that survive that is.) 01:22:03 PM Dolores D:We do not know that, but we did find out that more than 50% of American families own pets. 01:22:22 PM Amy Sebring:(Thanks Dee, and speaking of surviving, wish me luck with the 4th grade!) 01:22:35 PM Avagene Moore:Rick, you are next. (bye Amy) 01:22:54 PM Dolores D:I would be willing to ask those questions in our reseach or any others that this group thinks is important. 01:23:00 PM Rick Tobin:I wanted to respond to an earlier question about planning resources... 01:23:08 PM Rick Tobin:There is also a wonderful guide from the University of Davis Extension for Disaster Preparedness Resources for Animals during disaster. It is also available on the Internet at www.vetmed.ucdavis.edu/vetext/INF-DI_DANRGuide.html 01:23:27 PM Avagene Moore:Thanks, Rick. ... 01:23:55 PM Avagene Moore:I understand that many cats and dogs are put to sleep after disasters; is this true? Unpleasant as it is.\ 01:23:59 PM Dolores D:Please remember we are here to post the news, resources and to provide research... 01:25:13 PM Dolores D:There is a report that can be found at http://www.unr.net about evacuation or euthanasia. 01:25:28 PM Avagene Moore:Another question for Dee? Just submit your question mark (?) and wait to be recognized. 01:25:50 PM Avagene Moore:I for one appreciate all these Net references. 01:25:58 PM Dolores D:By making the public aware of the laws, facts, regulations, etc. individuals may take it upon themselves to better plan for the safety of 01:26:07 PM larry:? 01:26:13 PM Dolores D:their family, including their animals... All too often people become victims because they do not understand what choices are available. 01:26:17 PM Avagene Moore:Larry. 01:26:39 PM Rick Tobin:? 01:27:24 PM Avagene Moore:Rick, please have your question ready after Larry's. 01:27:25 PM Terry Storer:? 01:27:41 PM larry:Not only do we as disater perpardness personnel have to plan for personnel anaimals but wild animals. Have see what takes place in fires when I lived in California and Colorado. 01:28:04 PM Avagene Moore:Dee, do you wish to comment? 01:29:16 PM Avagene Moore:Dee are you ready for next question from Rick? 01:29:41 PM Dolores D:We will post any information to help all animals. Our managain editor... 01:30:05 PM Dolores D:is writing a book about a whilte mule that saved horses in Washoe Valley, NV. 01:30:13 PM Avagene Moore:Rick. 01:30:30 PM Rick Tobin:There are some serious problems with local non profits getting any reimbursement for helping animals in federally declared disasters. Has your organization heard of any push to change FEMA's policies for reimbursement? 01:31:44 PM Dolores D:I know that some non profits are requesting grants from various areas to help tham be prepared before disaster strikes. 01:31:48 PM chip hines:? 01:31:51 PM Avagene Moore:Terry, please. 01:31:57 PM Terry Storer:A comment, the importance of identifying "animal friendly" shelters is a must as many familys willl not enter a shelter without their pets. 01:32:10 PM Avagene Moore:Chip, please. 01:32:24 PM chip hines:I think Larry has a good point. Animals that are displaced from their natural habitat... 01:32:48 PM chip hines:are at greatly increased risk, not the least of which is from man... 01:32:54 PM Dolores D:There are problems with health requlations, I've ebbn told, and these shelters must be identified... 01:33:10 PM Dolores D:as special assistance shelters. 01:33:31 PM David Crews:? 01:33:43 PM Avagene Moore:Chip, please finish your comment. 01:33:52 PM chip hines:Also they can become a nuisance, and if plans to increase the ability to deal with this problem are not put in place, the problem will just become worse. 01:34:02 PM Dolores D:There is also the emotional damage that occurs when famalies are not allowed to care for their animals during times of disaster... 01:34:42 PM Dolores D:I found this out when our champion hunter jumper (horse) was at a training barn and the Nevad flood washed the roads away... 01:35:13 PM Dolores D:we could not see him for three weeks and did not have a way of seeing him until the roads were re-build! 01:35:17 PM Avagene Moore:David, your turn now. 01:35:21 PM David Crews:What kind of personal planning have you done for your horses? 01:36:11 PM Dolores D:We have purchased a 4 horse slant, we have set up with friends three different locations to move out animals, we have purchased 4 tons of hay ... 01:36:32 PM Dolores D:We also are aware of where we can move our animals to Fair Ground, etc... 01:37:01 PM Dolores D:I try to walk my talk and let people know they too msut plan and talk to their neighbors. 01:37:06 PM Avagene Moore:Dee, good for you! Sounds like you practice what you preach! 01:37:24 PM Avagene Moore:Are we talking a basic education problem here? 01:37:28 PM Joe Bills:I have been working on this issue for four years now. The best advice is that all animal owners must prepare to deal with the animals themselves and as a group. Horse people are especially well organized and can, as local groups initate planning to take care of their charges. 01:38:03 PM Avagene Moore:Why are the horse people so well prepared? Investment perhaps? 01:38:18 PM Dolores D:I agree and that is why The Horse Review will continue to post messages, stories and creat links to professional sites... 01:38:24 PM larry:Comment - When planning for evacuation of your home plan for the pets also. We had a person die here in teh area when he went back into a burning house to rescure his dog. 01:38:33 PM Rick Tobin:? 01:38:52 PM Dolores D:We have found that animals owners must help themselves, but it helps if they can learn how to do that from the experts. 01:38:59 PM Avagene Moore:Rick. 01:39:56 PM Bill Feist:? 01:39:58 PM Dolores D:It is sad when peopel risk their lives for their pets, but it happens. Here a friend and her husband helped save 28 horses from a wild fire... 01:40:08 PM Rick Tobin:One of the toughest problem with the rescue groups, and there are many for each species, is learning how to work with local law and fire authorities, who often are reluctant to work with these organizations. 01:40:28 PM Dolores D:They followed the basic rules for safety and saved lives because they tried. 01:40:35 PM Avagene Moore:Good point, Rick. Bill, your question. 01:41:01 PM Bill Feist:Although you are all probably aware of this already, EMI has just release two new home study courses dealing with the subject of animals in disasters. 01:41:27 PM Avagene Moore:Yes, and I am glad this material is available. Other questions of Dee? 01:41:28 PM Dolores D:In Sparks, Nevada, the local disaster planner has set up a group that includes not only law enforcement and fire but people like me who can help get the message out. 01:42:00 PM Avagene Moore:Would that be the best approach to make a community aware of the need for planning for animals? 01:42:17 PM Dolores D:Bill, how do we get information about the courses to post so barn owners, trainers, etc. can participate? 01:43:04 PM Dolores D:The best approach is communication. A public awareness campign that provides updates and information across the county would help... 01:43:22 PM Joe Bills:Bill is talking about the same course I gave the FEMA web site for previously. 01:43:42 PM Dolores D:People need to talk, to access the web and to be asked the simple question - do you ahve a disaster plan in place? 01:43:56 PM Dolores D:Joe, thank you. 01:44:04 PM Avagene Moore:Dee, is there an association of veteranarians involved in this sort of issue? 01:44:50 PM Isabel McCurdy:? 01:44:57 PM Dolores D:Yes, the president of our state's board is very active in our plans. He will even teach classes. 01:45:11 PM Avagene Moore:Isabel, you have a question. 01:45:18 PM Isabel McCurdy:Dee, what "experts" were you referring to? Local SPCA, etc? 01:45:27 PM cindy rice:? 01:46:13 PM Dolores D:Representaives from the Humane Society, or those that teach disaster preparedness classes... 01:46:41 PM Dolores D:We are posting news updates daily, and that information comes from organizations across the US. 01:46:51 PM Avagene Moore:Cindy, your question please. 01:47:14 PM cindy rice:Most of the conversation has revolved around larger animals, but what about companion animals for the disable population who "need" their animals with them to function Adequately? Are there plans being made anyplace to take these individuals and their animals into consideration? 01:47:51 PM Rick Tobin: ? 01:47:59 PM Dolores D:Yes, most of the plans I have found on-line deal only with small household pets. 01:48:08 PM Avagene Moore:Rick. 01:48:21 PM Rick Tobin:In California the California Veterniary Medical Association is a very involved organization. 01:48:37 PM Rick Tobin:Also, I could fill you in on the service animal issue if you like. 01:49:21 PM Dolores D:Please note the URL I posed should go to the home page htt://www.unr.net/~lbevan/adac/frmain.htm 01:49:52 PM Dolores D:Rick, any information we can post would help! 01:50:10 PM Avagene Moore:Most places accommodate service animals, don't they? Are they a problem in disaster situations? 01:50:35 PM Rick Tobin:The Red Cross now allows service animals for people with disabilities in their shelters---mostly dogs, but this could include Capuchin monkeys which help those who have special motorized wheel chairs. 01:51:12 PM Rick Tobin:This is a complex issue, and one we could spend an entire session on. 01:51:15 PM Dolores D:If there is not a plan in place, all animals become part of the problem. Only with planning can animals have a chance during a disaster! 01:51:27 PM Avagene Moore:So this is not an easy thing for those animals and their owners either. 01:52:09 PM Rick Tobin:No, not at all. And in the past, many shelters even turned away service animals, which is very traumatic and illegal. 01:52:28 PM Dolores D:No, see people run helters and they are human, they are also usually acting on the information provided... 01:53:00 PM Dolores D:If they do not know the rules, or the plan is not complete - then there are problems and lives are lost. 01:54:00 PM Dolores D:I can not stress the importance of taking action before a disaster. People need to ask questions and have plans in place long before disaster strikes! 01:54:39 PM Avagene Moore:This is fascinating and we have only begun to talk about this topic, I think.... 01:55:02 PM Avagene Moore:Dee we are about out of time... 01:55:02 PM Dolores D:When I say "people," I mean the people who own animals. We must be responsible for all members of our own families... 01:55:25 PM Dolores D:but information is what gives us power in making choices! 01:55:48 PM Avagene Moore:Exactly, Dee. Thanks for being here today and sharing this valuable information.... 01:56:04 PM Joe Bills:I spoke at the emergency management workshop of the US Animal Health Association annual conference on Sunday. This is one of the most important meetings for animal health providers in the country. We expected 25 in the session and 200 showed up! They are taking notice of this problem. 01:56:06 PM Avagene Moore:Tomorrow, we will hear a paper presented by Dr. Tom Schmidlin, Kent University --- the paper is a study on "Risk factors for Death in February '98 Florida Tornadoes." Join us at 12:00 Noon Eastern time in the Virtual Library..... 01:56:21 PM Avagene Moore:Thank you, Dee, for a good session. Wish you well with your online publication, The Horse Review, and your endeavors to educate the public and the emergency management community about our co-inhabitants on this planet, the wonderful animals. ... 01:56:38 PM Avagene Moore:Thanks to our audience also --- glad to have you with us today and invite you back each time you can join us in the Virtual Forum.... 01:56:55 PM Avagene Moore:If any of you have other questions for Dee and she is willing ... 01:57:16 PM Avagene Moore:we can hang around a few minutes and continue to discuss informally. All right. 01:57:43 PM Avagene Moore:Thanks for being here today. This has been a great discussion. We will follow up in the near future. 01:57:56 PM Dolores D:I want to thank all of you! 01:58:03 PM Avagene Moore:Dee thank you so much. Hope this was enjoyable for you. 01:58:26 PM Rick Tobin:You can't believe what a political hot potato this is also. Wait till the Wisconsin study comes out! Thanks so much, Dolores. 01:58:41 PM Avagene Moore:What Wisconsin study? 01:59:10 PM Joe Bills:No kidding Rick. My friend Dr. Heath of Purdue is working on it. 01:59:27 PM Rick Tobin:The hazmat accident where the public was directed to leave their animals behind for a few hours/or a day...they were out for weeks, animals died....6 months later all the politicians were booted out. 01:59:32 PM Avagene Moore:I met Dr Heath last summer in Boulder, Joe. 02:00:16 PM Joe Bills:Dr. Heath is doing his Phd thesis on the incident. Had dinner with him Sunday night 02:00:31 PM Avagene Moore:Wow. This is the reason this needs to be brought to light. I am sure a lot of people prefer not to think about this. Or do anymore planning. 02:00:35 PM Dolores D:In Nevada a ranch owner left his hole herd of cattle in the waters of Washoe Valley. 02:01:12 PM Dolores D:Most all of them died a slow death from no food or drowning. No one did anything for days! 02:01:12 PM Rick Tobin:Well, this is one of the keystones of the Landark Shelter Project, Avagene. 02:02:12 PM Joe Bills:Florida did a great job during the fires last May. Few animals were lost and we are talking about moving large herds of cattle quickly. The Ocala T-bred people helped out by opening their farms as well. 02:02:17 PM Avagene Moore:Figured as much, Rick. 02:02:25 PM Dolores D:We care here to help, just let us know how and we will. Each of our team has real life expereinces and we care! 02:03:16 PM Rick Tobin:Florida has a very good model. 02:03:46 PM Joe Bills:Indiana is another role model. Dr. Heath helped write that plan. 02:04:07 PM Dolores D:Yes, Flordia does, but their web site is very slow - 4 minuted to paint pages, too hard for most people to wait! 02:04:10 PM Isabel McCurdy:Dee, is there any Canadian organizations that you have hooked up with? 02:04:21 PM Avagene Moore:I imagine there are a lot of horror stories that some would prefer to hide or cover up. Sad. 02:04:58 PM Dolores D:I am working with a group in Canada that posts missing horses. We are just starting, but I do not have that URL right a hand. 02:05:44 PM Dolores D:We hope that our songs will start making people listen in a postive way - there are 4 all about animal heros! 02:06:21 PM Isabel McCurdy:Any other international organizations? 02:06:28 PM Joe Bills:Our next project at FEMA is to work on a course for large animals. We expect support from agricultural interests to help move this one along. 02:06:28 PM Avagene Moore:Dolores, I appreciate what you are doing and hope the Virtual Forum can help with this education of people. 02:06:38 PM David Crews:Joe, what do you know about the National VMATs under ESF-8? (Vet Med Assist Teams) 02:06:42 PM Rick Tobin:Let me know more about the horse songs. Might have an outlet for them.CW? 02:07:08 PM Dolores D:Joe, I know Dr. Coli could give you some background. 02:07:19 PM Joe Bills:VMATs are getting organizaed. AVMA has the lead on this one 02:07:42 PM Rick Tobin:Last thing I heard was they were very dedicated, but terribly underfunded. 02:07:49 PM Joe Bills:Would appreciate any help we can get. 02:08:49 PM David Crews:Do you have info on teams being formed and where? 02:08:56 PM Avagene Moore:Dolores, you did a great job for us today. I appreciate your time and expertise. Joe, I will be contacting you about a future panel. Everyone --- I have to check out and get to the Buffalo airport and catch a plane. Please feel free to stay and talk as long as you like. 02:09:01 PM Joe Bills:The US Public Health Service, under which VMAT is organized is helping. VMAT's, upon activation, become temporary Federal employees. Things are starting to move. 02:09:28 PM David Crews:Thanks Avagene! 02:09:28 PM Avagene Moore:Bye for now from sunny downtown Amhearst, Univ of NY. 02:09:37 PM Dolores D:David, you might call Mike Steele at the City fo Sparks, NV he is starting some great work. 02:09:40 PM Isabel McCurdy:Jose, do you know of any animal planning? Jose is from Lima, Peru. 02:10:00 PM Joe Bills:David, the VMAT's are vets and vet techs who will go into a disaster area to assist with animal related health issues. They become Federal employees on activation. 02:10:19 PM Rick Tobin:Notice how people always "have to go" to Buffalo--especially in the winter? 02:10:41 PM Dolores D:Jose, if youhave a plan or info we will also post it, we do have links even from Africa! 02:11:31 PM Dolores D:Does anyone hav any more questions for me? 02:11:59 PM Joe Bills:VMAT's will assess needs and work with local and state assests to deal with animals. In the future we hope they will be equiped to set up MASH operations. 02:12:02 PM Rick Tobin:In my book I posted about twenty good Internet sites with materials for planning for animals in disaster. 02:12:14 PM Isabel McCurdy:post your email address, Dee. 02:12:24 PM David Crews:Thanks for the good info and URLs. I will put them on my website EM Gold! 02:12:26 PM Dolores D:Joe, please send me information. 02:12:50 PM Dolores D:deebeauges@visual-imagry.com 02:13:07 PM Joe Bills:Delores, on the VMATS? 02:13:41 PM Dolores D:Joe I will need to find out. 02:14:53 PM Dolores D:Thank you I must go to Reno now for a meeting with the feed store about our winter HAY Watch Program. Thank you for your support and interest in animals and their safety!