08:05:57 PM Amy Sebring:I suppose we might as well get started... 08:06:01 PM BWallrich:I will use some shorthand to speed things up. pwd=persons with disabilities; esf6=mass care, primarily shelter; arc=American Red Cross; ada=Americans w/Disabilities Act 08:06:03 PM Amy Sebring:Burt, do you want to kick us off. 08:06:13 PM BWallrich:Sure 08:06:16 PM Ashley Streetman:Poor Avagene... 08:06:32 PM Amy Sebring:Hello Rick, we are just getting started. 08:06:40 PM BWallrich:Hi, Rick 08:06:47 PM Rick Tobin:thanks, always glad to hear what Burt has to say. 08:06:57 PM Amy Sebring:Burt has given us the acronym definitions, and away we go. 08:07:35 PM BWallrich:Anyone logged on who is in a jurisdiction that has, or is developing, a formal esf6 plan for pwd? 08:07:55 PM Amy Sebring:not yet 08:07:59 PM Isabel McCurdy:no 08:08:18 PM BWallrich:I take silence for no. In Calif. we have been meeting for about 2 years to develop a formal plan 08:08:43 PM BWallrich:The participants are state and local agencies with esf6 responsibilities... 08:08:56 PM BWallrich:state agencies with pwd responsibilities... 08:09:19 PM BWallrich:reps. from organizations that advocate for pwd, and the arc 08:09:40 PM BWallrich:At the outset, the discussions were very polarized... 08:10:06 PM BWallrich:The pwd advocates were insisting on fulll compliance withthe ada... 08:10:25 PM BWallrich:The arc was insisting that it was not capable of sheltering pwds 08:10:49 PM BWallrich:Rick, you have been there from the beginning, or at least at the beginning. Is this accurate, in your view? 08:12:30 PM Amy Sebring:Rick may have been called away Burt. Let's assume for the moment it is. 08:12:39 PM BWallrich:Over time, people have moved off their polar positions and engaged in effective problem-solving 08:12:59 PM BWallrich:[I was trying to break up the monologue] 08:13:16 PM BWallrich:Key understandings that allowed progress included:... 08:13:20 PM Rick Tobin:Sorry, yes, I agree with Burt, but the product moved slowly---the price of consensus building. 08:14:06 PM BWallrich:arc learned that most pwd are not medically dependent. They need access, not nursing care 08:14:24 PM BWallrich:This was a major step forward in understanding 08:15:21 PM BWallrich:The advocates accepted that esf6 facilities are not under the control of the arc except to a limited extent when they are actually being used as shelters 08:16:06 PM BWallrich:The advocates also accepted that esf6 facilities are very temporary and cannot be made fully ada compliant in the context of a disaster 08:16:42 PM BWallrich:The arc learned that considerable access can often be achieved through small, easy, inexpensive steps 08:17:02 PM BWallrich:These were the basic agreements people came to over time 08:17:34 PM BWallrich:Shawn's here, not I have to be honest. Shawn has been the convener of these 2 year's of meetings 08:17:44 PM Amy Sebring:Welcome Shawn. 08:17:57 PM Amy Sebring:Were you convener as pwd advocate? 08:18:03 PM BWallrich:...that is, NOW i have to be honest 08:18:06 PM shawn ortiz:Hello, sorry for being tardy. 08:18:46 PM shawn ortiz:Thank you all. 08:19:26 PM Amy Sebring:Burt, can you describe Shawn's interest and role, or would Shawn like to do it? 08:19:49 PM Amy Sebring:We lost Burt, so Shawn I guess it is up to you. 08:20:06 PM Amy Sebring:Burt was just telling us that you were convener of these 2 years worth of meetings. 08:20:06 PM Rick Tobin:I'll be glad to help, Shawn. 08:20:18 PM Amy Sebring:He has already given us a general background of the process. 08:21:50 PM Burt Wallrich:I'm back. I'm getting whiplash from being bounced out so often 08:21:54 PM shawn ortiz:Okay, Burt. I am the program manager for Emergency Welfare Services (EWS) a unit of the Disaster Response Services Unit within the California Department of Social Services. We have responsibility for care and shelter. We share this with County Governemnt. There are 58 counties. We also have lots of strategic partners. 08:22:40 PM shawn ortiz:HI, Burt I though you abandoned me. 08:22:44 PM Amy Sebring:So this process took place at the state-wide level? 08:23:09 PM shawn ortiz:Yes and partly no. 08:23:13 PM Burt Wallrich:Shawn, is it possible for you to review what I have said so far? 08:23:26 PM Amy Sebring:He will only be able to see part of it Burt. 08:23:38 PM Amy Sebring:I told him that you had given us the general overview of the process. 08:24:10 PM Burt Wallrich:OK. I tried to lay out the basic understandings that got people off their polar positions. 08:24:18 PM Amy Sebring:partly no Shawn? 08:24:38 PM shawn ortiz:EWS is the point for care and shelter within State Government. Our startegic partners are the Governor's Office of Emergency Services and the American Red Cross. Burt's Info Line Los Angeles, can be considered a partner. 08:25:26 PM Amy Sebring:What is the current status of this effort, and/or results to date? 08:25:40 PM Burt Wallrich:We had strong participation from one of the independent living centers and from the city of Pasadena ada compliance officer 08:26:04 PM Burt Wallrich:Everyone has agreed that potential shelters will be surveyed and rated as to accessibility... 08:26:22 PM shawn ortiz:The Strategic Planning Committee for Persons with Disabilities is a statewide effort. That is the yes part. The no part is that County Government and the local chapters of the ARC are most responsible for the actual delivery of services. 08:27:01 PM Burt Wallrich:from fully accessible, good accessibility with some easy modifications, and not at all accessible 08:27:16 PM Amy Sebring:That was my next question Shawn or Burt.... 08:27:27 PM Amy Sebring:did you have participation from the counties and chapters? 08:28:00 PM shawn ortiz:Yes. 08:28:24 PM Burt Wallrich:From 2 arc chapters and 1 county. So, Shawn, I think it is heavily a state effort at the planning level, ... 08:28:36 PM Burt Wallrich:but will be a local effort at implementation 08:29:07 PM Amy Sebring:Let's open this up to our other participants here tonight. 08:29:27 PM Burt Wallrich:Yes! 08:29:28 PM Amy Sebring:Isabel, can you give us an idea what Canada is doing in this regard that you are aware of? 08:29:50 PM Amy Sebring:If you have any idea, not that you are expected to! 08:29:51 PM Isabel McCurdy:Our services are different... 08:30:56 PM Isabel McCurdy:Red Cross for example is responsible for inquiry and registration... 08:31:39 PM shawn ortiz:Government provides hands on service? 08:31:45 PM Isabel McCurdy:Our Social Services look after the shelters.. 08:32:49 PM Isabel McCurdy:Emergency Social Sevices is a government responsibility... 08:33:23 PM Isabel McCurdy:But our legislation is a little different.. 08:33:39 PM shawn ortiz:Do yo have a citizens advisory council, board or commission? 08:33:41 PM shawn ortiz:Do yo have a citizens advisory council, board or commission? 08:34:28 PM Isabel McCurdy:I am sure there is but I do not know how involved they are.. 08:35:29 PM Isabel McCurdy:I read our cities plan and I don't recall there beinga anything specific for the disabled. 08:35:44 PM Amy Sebring:Burt, with regular everyday requirements for ADA compliance, why is this a problem? 08:35:54 PM Burt Wallrich:I believe government has responsibility for mass care here, also, The fact that they have an agreement with arc doesn't relieve them of responsibility 08:36:02 PM Amy Sebring:That is, are there not sufficient facilities that are already ADA compliant? 08:36:25 PM Burt Wallrich:Amy, not all buildings are ada compliant. An older building that has not been renovated, for example... 08:36:34 PM shawn ortiz:This is very true. 08:36:49 PM Amy Sebring:Yes, but are there not sufficient facilities that are? 08:36:50 PM Burt Wallrich:There are also some exceptions, I believe. Shawn, are churches covered by ada? 08:36:58 PM Amy Sebring:Especially in California! 08:37:14 PM Amy Sebring:Who selects the facilities in California, ARC? 08:37:20 PM Burt Wallrich:Schools are usually used for shelters, and many are not fully accessible. 08:37:45 PM Burt Wallrich:In L.A. it's the arc. Is that true in all counties, Shawn? 08:38:22 PM Burt Wallrich:And it's not just physical access that's in question. It's signage, communications, etc. 08:38:58 PM Amy Sebring:Megan is a Red Cross Volunteer. 08:39:15 PM Amy Sebring:Megan, how does it work in your area which is Michigan (?) 08:39:16 PM Burt Wallrich:For example, arc has agreed to try to have TDDs (telephone devices for the deaf) in shelters if the shelters will be open for more than a few days 08:40:09 PM shawn ortiz:Yes, but the case law and legislative policy has a lot of grey in it. It depends upon services being provided. ARC provides services statewide. Our Statement of Operational Relationship (SOR) designates the ARC as the lead for shelter locations. The idea is a working relationship with local county Offices of Emergency Services. 08:40:53 PM Burt Wallrich:The arc is agreeing not to use the class 3 (inaccessible) shelters except in extreme need 08:41:05 PM Amy Sebring:Has the outcome of this process been carried to all counties, or will it? 08:41:26 PM Burt Wallrich:It will be, but that will take time. 08:41:31 PM shawn ortiz:No. 08:41:50 PM Burt Wallrich:[obviously we're not in collusion] 08:41:59 PM shawn ortiz:No it as not and yes it will. 08:42:03 PM Amy Sebring:No, as in not yet. 08:42:20 PM Amy Sebring:Rick, would you like to chime in? 08:42:38 PM Rick Tobin:Well, I would like a clarification from Shawn and Burt on a key issue here... 08:42:42 PM Amy Sebring:(I am putting everyone equally on the spont tonite!) 08:43:04 PM Amy Sebring:(spot) 08:43:06 PM Rick Tobin:the bottom line is that ADA is a federal law, not a state law, and that causes many complications... 08:43:35 PM shawn ortiz:California government and concensus politics all in real time. (Smile) 08:43:42 PM Burt Wallrich:A big part of what the committee has come up with is based on education and public information 08:43:47 PM Rick Tobin:Second, the document that will be produced is more of a guide, not a binding regulation, and that has to be kept in mind in a state where the counties maintain local authority. 08:44:33 PM Rick Tobin:Third, the differences between large urban counties and more remote rural counties is huge as far as resources, staff, and implementation capability... 08:44:50 PM Rick Tobin:But nobody said it would be easy 8-) 08:45:08 PM Amy Sebring:That's why they pay us these exorbitant salaries!! 08:45:13 PM Amy Sebring:(joke) 08:45:39 PM Amy Sebring:During this process, have you looked at what other states have done? 08:45:46 PM Rick Tobin:yes 08:45:59 PM Burt Wallrich:I think the work of the committee is on 2 levels. One is the agreements we are reaching... 08:46:37 PM Burt Wallrich:the other is breaking down high walls of fear. ARC fear that they will have to provide medical care for a lot of people.... 08:46:54 PM Burt Wallrich:and advocates fear that if they give even a little on the ada they will lose it all.... 08:47:20 PM Burt Wallrich:the process has gone some distance towards reassurance of good will... 08:47:23 PM shawn ortiz:California is dynamic. The Strategic Planning Committee is one of the forums for resolving the inherent paradoxes. Rick, Burt and the views of all the other members is valid. 08:48:20 PM shawn ortiz:We are at least at the table and fully engaged in constructive dialoge. 08:48:25 PM Amy Sebring:And what about those who may require limited medical care? What are you telling those people? 08:48:47 PM shawn ortiz:Rick. 08:48:58 PM Burt Wallrich:People who are medically dependent would have to be sheltered in a medical facility, right? 08:49:25 PM Rick Tobin:The other committee I work on is wrestiling with that issue... 08:49:43 PM Rick Tobin:remember, there is a cross over of cohorts here... 08:50:02 PM Rick Tobin:some medically fragile populations are ADA qualified, some are not... 08:50:08 PM Rick Tobin:and conversely, 08:50:53 PM Rick Tobin:and, there is a huge new, growing universe of citizens being treated from home that are not even a day-to-day player in the sheltering planning basis...at least not commonly... 08:51:02 PM shawn ortiz:There are as you can see many facets to this diamond. We are joined in our efforts by a process of specialist and technical committees. 08:51:05 PM Amy Sebring:absolutely 08:51:07 PM Rick Tobin:it is a huge challenge, and only promises to grow. 08:51:27 PM Amy Sebring:I face the difficulty of communicating to response agencies... 08:51:41 PM Amy Sebring:who want nothing to do with social services, because it is not their function. 08:51:46 PM Burt Wallrich:ARC is not tasked to deal with medical needs, and cannot in the middle of a disaster. They needed reassurance that people understand that. 08:51:53 PM Rick Tobin:There are a lot of people working hard at this egg, trying to crack it...I see incredibly dedication across the board. 08:51:57 PM Amy Sebring:The last major hurricane was 30 years ago. 08:52:08 PM Amy Sebring:The world has changed in 30 years.... 08:52:19 PM Amy Sebring:in terms of de-institutionalizing care. 08:52:53 PM Burt Wallrich:...and rising expectations. 08:52:54 PM Amy Sebring:This works reasonably well during normal times... 08:53:04 PM Amy Sebring:but presents huge challenges in times of disaster. 08:53:15 PM shawn ortiz:Rick you may want to share the modeling done by the State of Florida, following Andrew. 08:53:21 PM Rick Tobin:What all of this comes down to is not law, not preparation, not plans...but public expectation of services and quality of services. It is very daunting to public servants who really care, and the community based organizations that are stretching every dollar. 08:53:26 PM Isabel McCurdy:Is there community nursing involved? 08:53:41 PM Burt Wallrich:Amy, there's a lot of anger right under the surface in the pwd world. It can explode if people feel their needs are being met appropriately. 08:53:59 PM Burt Wallrich:...are NOT being met appropriately... 08:54:30 PM Rick Tobin:Yes, the Florida model tries to move medically fragile populations in a triage format... 08:54:45 PM Rick Tobin:First, try to move people early to "LIKE FACILITIES" 08:55:24 PM Rick Tobin:Second, if you must move medically fragile to shelter, triage them at the entry or holding area to move them to appropriate care facilities, if at all possible.... 08:55:46 PM Rick Tobin:Third, provide for special medical treatment shelters---including caching of supplies... 08:56:41 PM Rick Tobin:And fourth, in worst case scenarios, work with ARC operations people to provide a space for a temporary dispensary area in the shelter, staffed by local community medical support. 08:57:00 PM Amy Sebring:We are not receiving any clear guidance on these issues in terms of responsibilities. 08:57:01 PM Rick Tobin:Actually, ARC calls it an infirmary, not a dispensary, sorry. 08:57:41 PM Rick Tobin:I yield the floor. 08:58:15 PM Burt Wallrich:We're about out of time, aren't we? [is this scheduled for an hour?] 08:58:26 PM Amy Sebring:Yes, your right Burt. 08:58:32 PM Amy Sebring:I had not even looked at the clock. 08:58:35 PM Rick Tobin:I must clarify one point... 08:58:41 PM Amy Sebring:To wrap up... 08:59:07 PM Amy Sebring:is the California process at the point where it is ready to be presented outside of California... 08:59:10 PM Rick Tobin:triaging the medically fragile evacuees does not mean moving people out of shelters when they have a disability...it is not the same thing, and no one has that in mind. 08:59:51 PM shawn ortiz:I would like to share with our non-engaged forum partners to view what is being attempted in California Emergency Humand services as a "Suite". Each specifically identified needs is intra-connected. The infrastructure for resolving the challenges is here right now. 09:00:27 PM Burt Wallrich:Give us 6 more months, right Shawn? Amy, would you post news from Avagene before tomorrow morning, if you get it, please. 09:00:46 PM Amy Sebring:Well, I would be satisfied if we just achieved an acknowledgement of the challenges!! 09:00:49 PM Amy Sebring:Yes, Burt. 09:00:52 PM Rick Tobin:I think there's a lot of kinks in the rope, yet. But at least we have a rope!! 09:01:03 PM Amy Sebring:I will ask Avagene to let you all know how she managed. 09:01:07 PM Burt Wallrich:Enough to hang ourselves???? 09:01:17 PM Amy Sebring:Thank you so much Burt for taking the lead here tonight... 09:01:25 PM Rick Tobin:Enough to pull each other through tough times!! 09:01:35 PM Amy Sebring:and thank you Shawn for the unexpected pleasure of your company and input. 09:01:36 PM shawn ortiz:In six months we should being engaged in explaining our recommendations. 09:01:49 PM Ashley Streetman:Yes, thank you Burt. 09:01:55 PM Burt Wallrich:It was fun, except for the repeated bounces. 09:01:59 PM Isabel McCurdy:Thank you 09:02:00 PM Rick Tobin:In 8 months the medical shelter recommendations will also be ready. 09:02:09 PM Burt Wallrich:Thank you all! 09:02:10 PM Amy Sebring:Very good Rick and all... 09:02:16 PM shawn ortiz:My pleasure. 09:02:20 PM Amy Sebring:we will be watching for further developements.... 09:02:27 PM Rick Tobin:As always, a pleasure Burt, and Shawn. 09:02:32 PM Amy Sebring:please keep us posted on your progress... 09:02:48 PM Amy Sebring:and feel free to take advantage of our mailing lists and discussion groups to do so!! 09:02:51 PM Amy Sebring:Plug, plug 09:03:00 PM shawn ortiz:See you all again. Out! 09:03:02 PM Amy Sebring:Thanks everyone else for being here tonight. 09:03:03 PM Burt Wallrich:Good night. 09:03:09 PM Amy Sebring:Please come again. 09:03:45 PM shawn ortiz:jso373@aol.com, any time. Feel freee to land here. 09:03:57 PM Amy Sebring:great shawn, thanks 09:04:24 PM Amy Sebring:Ashley, didn't get to put you on the spot! Sorry. 09:04:45 PM Ashley Streetman::) No problem... 09:04:50 PM Rick Tobin:Yes, any questions Ashley? 09:05:01 PM Amy Sebring:But you certainly don't need to wait to be asked! 09:05:09 PM Ashley Streetman:I am not familiar with this end at all, so it is very interesting for me. 09:05:43 PM Amy Sebring:bye guys 09:05:56 PM Isabel McCurdy:bye 09:06:13 PM Ashley Streetman:Goodnight all! 09:06:14 PM Isabel McCurdy:Rick, are you here? 09:06:39 PM Rick Tobin:yes, Isabel. 09:07:01 PM Rick Tobin:Can I help you? 09:07:24 PM Isabel McCurdy:I wanted to ask you if you have any more info re;policy development? 09:08:11 PM Rick Tobin:How so? Which level of policy? For what? ADA? Medically fragile? 09:08:54 PM Isabel McCurdy:Policy development framework, generally speaking? 09:09:37 PM Rick Tobin:I'm still a little fuzzy on the question. Do you mean developing an approach based on law, regulations, best practices? 09:09:51 PM Isabel McCurdy:Yes!!! 09:10:26 PM Rick Tobin:That is probably best addressed in courses dealing with government policy development. Many universities offer them, as well as government training centers. 09:11:26 PM Isabel McCurdy:I am taking a policy & practice course now , but nothing for emergency management. 09:12:21 PM Rick Tobin:We have a gentleman in the cube next to me who came from Washington (worked for a Senator there) who has a master's in that area. He may be the best source I know and trust. Want an e-mail address? 09:12:36 PM Isabel McCurdy:Please. 09:12:45 PM Rick Tobin:Adam_Sutkus@oes.ca.gov 09:12:55 PM Rick Tobin:Tell Adam we talked about this. 09:13:22 PM Isabel McCurdy:Thanks Rick. 09:13:31 PM Rick Tobin:His also very active in a Public Manager's Association. You might ask him about that, as well. 09:13:34 PM Isabel McCurdy:Appreciate it very much. 09:13:42 PM Rick Tobin:Anything else? 09:13:58 PM Isabel McCurdy:No. That is great. 09:14:05 PM Rick Tobin:Oh, also try the archives of the Natural Hazards Research Institute in Boulder, California 09:14:28 PM Rick Tobin:they have a wonderful monthly bulletin (free) and a great web site with tons of reference docs. 09:14:57 PM Isabel McCurdy:What is the address? 09:15:55 PM Rick Tobin:I don't have it on the bookmarks where I am. Send me an e-mail at home asking for it and I'll send it tonight. rtobin@foothill.net (shhhh...it's one of the sites in my book) 09:16:17 PM Megan Gilge: http://www.colorado.edu/hazards 09:16:42 PM Rick Tobin:Thanks Megan. I tell ya...she sharp, and a lot faster than us rusty old fellas. 09:16:59 PM Isabel McCurdy:What's old? 09:17:18 PM Megan Gilge:Looked it up off an old copy of Disaster Research 09:17:19 PM Isabel McCurdy:19 and over? 09:17:23 PM Rick Tobin:Old is when you look in the mirror in the morning and realize you have your father's face. 09:17:28 PM Rick Tobin:gotta go. 09:17:45 PM Isabel McCurdy:Thanks Megan. 09:18:34 PM Isabel McCurdy:I have to go. Bye,Bye. 09:19:01 PM Megan Gilge:Bye 09:19:38 PM Cathe:Oops. Wrong place. 10:09:47 PM firefred:Good night you guys I am chatting from sunny jamaica how are you all?