08:08:49 PM Avagene Moore:Good evening! Welcome to the EIIP Virtual Forum Round Table..... 08:09:01 PM Avagene Moore:Tonight's topic is the role of the clergy in emergency management.... 08:09:11 PM Avagene Moore:Ken Baechel, Chaplain for the International Association of Emergency Managers (IAEM), formerly NCCEM, will lead us in our informal discussion.... 08:09:24 PM Avagene Moore:We want everyone to feel free to join in as appropriate.... 08:09:36 PM Avagene Moore:Ken liked the questions used to promote tonight's session and he asked me to make sure those questions are addressed.... 08:09:52 PM Ken Baechel:Let us pray.............Amen 08:10:09 PM Avagene Moore:I will start our discussion by posing a very basic question to Ken.... 08:10:10 PM Ken Baechel:Question #1 08:10:20 PM Avagene Moore:What role does the clergy or the local ministerial association play in emergency management? 08:10:49 PM Ken Baechel:That is what we are here to find out 08:11:05 PM Ken Baechel:does anyone have clergy 08:11:16 PM Ken Baechel:on your LEPC 08:11:54 PM Ken Baechel:Chaplain for fire dept 08:12:05 PM Ken Baechel:Chap. for police 08:12:11 PM Randall Duncan:I have a question for you Ken -- do all types of disasters share a common impact on those affected (victims)? How does clergy training help / hinder a person dealing with the impact of a disaster? 08:12:52 PM Avagene Moore:Good question, Randy. 08:12:54 PM Ken Baechel:Unfortunately training and desire to de counsilors 08:13:07 PM Ken Baechel:is incinsistant so 08:13:24 PM Ken Baechel:you cannot depend on 08:13:41 PM Ken Baechel:uniform responce and skills 08:14:14 PM Amy Sebring:That is, clergy, like general population has individual strengths, weaknesses. 08:14:20 PM Ken Baechel:Just because you care does not 08:14:36 PM Ken Baechel:mean you can be of help 08:14:50 PM Ken Baechel:like emergy management 08:15:09 PM Ken Baechel:it takes traininf and education 08:15:26 PM Ken Baechel:What resources 08:15:44 PM Ken Baechel:do you think chergy could provide 08:16:11 PM Burt Wallrich:This is not directly to the point but it is related. The local VOAD in L.A. is basically organized by function, e.g., food, homeless services, mental health, etc. We have found that communities of faith (churches, mosques, temples, etc.) are more interested in being identified as such, rather than by specific function. Therefore, we are in the process of organizing a Communities of Faith committee within LAVOAD. CWS and World Vision are jointly taking the lead. 08:17:09 PM Amy Sebring:Some denominations seem to take a specific interest, such as Catholic Relief, Methodist services, etc. 08:17:43 PM Amy Sebring:Baptist men, Salvation Army 08:17:50 PM Burt Wallrich:We have the faith-based relief organizations under their specific functions. This is the churches (etc.) themselves, not their relief arm. 08:17:57 PM Avagene Moore:In other words, just because a person is a member of the clergy doesn't qualify them for counseling in times of disasters. Is it fair to say that some people aren't cut out for that type of work regardless of training? 08:18:10 PM Ken Baechel:Could you use their churches, schools etc. for shelters etc. 08:18:18 PM Randall Duncan:Ken and Burt. I had experience with both counselors and local ministerial alliance during our presidential declaration in 1991 (Andover tornado). Some training for helping our folks came through FEMA funding attendance at NOVA (National Organization for Victim Advocacy). Is anyone else familiar with this training or other resources? 08:18:20 PM Ken Baechel:Yes 08:18:37 PM Burt Wallrich:No 08:18:41 PM Avagene Moore:No, I have never heard of it. 08:19:00 PM Amy Sebring:We have Metro Ministries who do sheltering for homeless on a daily basis... 08:19:18 PM Amy Sebring:they also receive emergency funds via FEMA I believe. 08:19:28 PM Amy Sebring:They will do some sheltering. 08:19:50 PM Amy Sebring:I am most interested in them as being in touch with a category of special needs. 08:20:05 PM Ken Baechel:What else can the clergy bring to the table? 08:20:08 PM Randall Duncan:Amy, I think they receive funding from the FEMA emergency housing program. It's a separate budget (not part of disaster response or mitigation). 08:20:21 PM Amy Sebring:Yes, Randy, that is what I meant. 08:20:27 PM Burt Wallrich:Yes. A lot of church organizations do on-going shelter, food, etc. After a disaster the churches want to be active. It's a delicate balancing act because they want to be recognized as faith communities but to provide service to all victims regardless of faith. 08:20:32 PM Randall Duncan:Correction to previous statement -- I believe it's emergency food and shelter program. 08:20:46 PM Avagene Moore:Randy and Amy, are the clergy or ministerial associations in your communities included in disaster training and exercises? 08:21:20 PM Amy Sebring:I had tried at one point to try to reach local clergy through a local ministerial association ... 08:21:34 PM Burt Wallrich:McKinney Act money is the on-going federal assistance for food and shelter (not disaster related). It is passed through FEMA on its way to the local communities and thus it gets known as FEMA money. But is has nothing to do with the Stafford Act or a presidentail declaration. 08:21:38 PM Amy Sebring:but was informed that this was almost a non-existent organization. 08:21:54 PM Randall Duncan:Avagene -- it's a great idea. I have had several meetings with our ministerial alliance, but mainly to discuss the provisions of our emergency plan. We have not been as open to encouraging their participation as it should be. 08:21:56 PM Amy Sebring:Yes, I know Burt. 08:22:28 PM Amy Sebring:But they are in touch with this homeless community on a daily basis... 08:22:40 PM Amy Sebring:when the hurricane comes, they know where to find them. 08:23:23 PM Avagene Moore:Is it fair to say that we often think of the clergy's role as counseling and consoling....but you are really trying to think of other ways they can serve, Ken. Right? 08:24:20 PM Randall Duncan:Correction to my previous statement. Due to slip of my fingers it sounded like the lack of participation was due to the alliance. That isn't correct. The lack of openess has been on our (emergency management's) part. With increased awareness from this discussion, I hope to correct my previous oversite. 08:24:46 PM Amy Sebring:One of our concerns is well meaning efforts ... 08:25:07 PM Amy Sebring:such as, we will probably have spontaneous sheltering in churches... 08:25:20 PM Amy Sebring:however, the building may not be suitable for a shelter... 08:25:25 PM Amy Sebring:i.e., unsafe. 08:26:11 PM Amy Sebring:One of the ways I would like for clergy/congregations to contribute... 08:26:18 PM Amy Sebring:is to help take care of their own. 08:26:33 PM Amy Sebring:That is, if a member of their own congregation needs special assistance... 08:26:37 PM Randall Duncan:Amy -- the issue of sheltering (particularly for tornadoes) comes up traditionally in our area. The problem with using any facility for a designated shelter is much as you have already identified. Plus, how can we assume responsibility for making sure churches are opened at the appropriate time, etc.? It IS a great delima! 08:26:41 PM Amy Sebring:that they help with that assistance. 08:27:32 PM Amy Sebring:I am thinking here of the elderly or poor. 08:27:38 PM Burt Wallrich:I always feel like I'm two comments behind. Churches are based in their communities in a way that most organizations are not. And this can be apart from the queston of who is a parishioner, who is not. The church is there and may be the first available to provide assistance, including shelter, food, reassurance. As far as chronic homelessness, it's different in different communities, Amy. Here, the services to chronic homeless are largely not church- related. We do have a Homeless Services Commi 08:28:15 PM Avagene Moore:One of the emails I received today pointed out the 'problem' that often times arises if the churches and other community groups are not aware of the community's plans and procedures..... 08:28:27 PM Amy Sebring:(you hit 256 character limitation Burt...break it up a little) 08:29:15 PM Avagene Moore:they may make well-intended plans to help, such as soliciting donated goods, without any thought of the community's policies on such things. 08:29:15 PM Burt Wallrich:Oh, I thought it was my brain that was only good for 256 characters. 08:29:34 PM Avagene Moore:(What happened to Ken?) 08:29:56 PM Amy Sebring:(We lost him somewhere along the way) 08:29:57 PM Randall Duncan:I saw an indication that he logged off earlier. Maybe he's had a techno-problem? 08:30:08 PM Amy Sebring:hopefully he will be back! 08:30:17 PM Avagene Moore:Must have. Hope he will be back. 08:30:59 PM Amy Sebring:It's not just a matter of community policy, Ava, but not being aware of what will be encountered or the ramifications. 08:31:14 PM Amy Sebring:We probably should do more to educate. 08:31:19 PM Avagene Moore:Right. Good point. 08:31:35 PM Amy Sebring:Just add it to the list of all the other impossible things we are supposed to do! 08:31:39 PM Burt Wallrich:A VOAD or other local coalition would be a place to do that. 08:32:08 PM Amy Sebring:United Way does serve as a focal point here, but it is rather limited. 08:32:23 PM Avagene Moore:Is anyone aware of any materials that address the types of problems we are talking about? I checked out the Net and couldn't find anything. 08:33:10 PM Burt Wallrich:World Vision has developed a disaster training for churches. We are working with them to review and modify it, and will help present it. 08:33:16 PM Randall Duncan:I think we're just a bit into uncharted territory with this discussion. In my opinion, this is another of those subjects we thought we had handled, only to find we really don't have it adequately handled! 08:33:41 PM Amy Sebring:Was unaware of World Vision effort. Can you tell us more Burt? 08:33:43 PM Burt Wallrich:One problem was that they had a lot of prosletyzing built in and we told them that if we were going to participate that wasn't kosher. 08:34:23 PM Amy Sebring:I see. Separation of church and state issue. 08:34:28 PM Burt Wallrich:Amy, this is a mega-curriculum that was developed in the WV LA office. We were just about to go into our first trianing 08:34:53 PM Burt Wallrich:when the woman in charge had to leave for health reasons. We are waiting for her to be replaced to go ahead. 08:34:55 PM Avagene Moore:Randy, you seem to be surprised --- why? (Ken is back!) 08:35:02 PM Ken Baechel:Sorry I locked up--bad exit and reboot 08:35:15 PM Burt Wallrich:WV is committed to it, even knowing our position on proselytizing (sp??). 08:35:19 PM Amy Sebring:glad you're back...we have carried on 08:35:25 PM Avagene Moore:We were worried about you but are carrying on, Ken. 08:35:32 PM Amy Sebring:(close enough sp Burt) 08:35:59 PM Amy Sebring:I am reminded of all the Biblical references to disaster. 08:36:14 PM Amy Sebring:Natural disasters may have been a reason FOR religion! 08:36:29 PM Avagene Moore:Ken, Randy was saying he thinks we are in uncharted waters here with this topic. I was asking him why he felt that way. Maybe you have an answer too. 08:36:39 PM Randall Duncan:I guess I'm not surprised so much as confirming that we constantly need to re-examine everything we do in emergency management. I think for years we thought we had a handle on what the clergy can do for us, and we really don't. I see a parallel to the early days of CISD -- "I'm a big, bad responder, and I don't need help." -- mindset. 08:37:27 PM Ken Baechel:We arn't sure what the questions are 08:37:51 PM Ken Baechel:I have one foot in each world 08:37:55 PM Burt Wallrich:Of course, the churches are a major source of volunteers and relief funds. If they aren't included in the overall game they will play on their own. And that's not good. 08:38:08 PM Amy Sebring:I agree Burt. 08:38:08 PM Ken Baechel:and I'm just guessing 08:38:44 PM Avagene Moore:Aren't we really talking about a comprehensive community preparedness program? 08:38:44 PM Ken Baechel:Churches are often vvery parochial 08:39:16 PM Amy Sebring:aren't we all Ken? 08:39:39 PM Ken Baechel:Hopefully less and less as we grow 08:39:55 PM Amy Sebring:I keep saying there is plenty of work to go around ... 08:40:05 PM Ken Baechel:True 08:40:13 PM Amy Sebring:the problem seems to come down there is not enough $$ to go around. 08:40:26 PM Burt Wallrich:Avagene, - yes, a comprehesive program is exactly what we are talking about. I keep beating the drum for a comprehesive VOAD or other coalition 08:40:28 PM Amy Sebring:Hence we are competing for funding. 08:40:48 PM Burt Wallrich:that brings together all types of community organizations plus government and maybe even business 08:41:10 PM Randall Duncan:I think Burt just made an excellent point about churches being a major player in volunteers and private funding. When there is "freelancing," the team effort to solve people's problems is lessened. 08:41:18 PM Ken Baechel:Perhaps the self immage of clergy is to help the poor more than respond to emergencies 08:41:27 PM Amy Sebring:Do you have such type of inclusive comprehensive planning on disasters in LA Burt? 08:41:28 PM Burt Wallrich:$$$ is a reality but it doesn't have to destroy cooperation. There are ways of recognizing the competition and then going forward 08:41:49 PM Avagene Moore:That is the concept for a comprehensive program --- I would argue that most programs are not truly comprehensive but are far more narrow in scope. 08:42:06 PM Amy Sebring:which may be as much the EM's fault as anyones. 08:42:17 PM Burt Wallrich:We are sure working on it, with some degree of success and a great deal of work still to do. In most of Southern California we have borad-based local VOADs. 08:42:23 PM Avagene Moore:And therefore leave out a large portion of the resource base of the community. 08:43:14 PM Burt Wallrich:The local VOAD is recognized in both LA city and LA county emergency plan as the primary point of contact for nonprofits AND their constituencies. 08:43:19 PM Amy Sebring:In Texas, I have found unfortunately that this broad inclusive approach is antithetical to a conservative political view. 08:44:03 PM Avagene Moore:It is the old "that's not the way we do it" problem. 08:44:09 PM Amy Sebring:Do you have that experience Randy? 08:44:15 PM Burt Wallrich:In many places there is a lot of bad history in the way - between ARC, Salvation Army, United Way, etc. 08:44:27 PM Burt Wallrich:Fortunately, here in LA we are past that. 08:44:44 PM Randall Duncan:Amy, I'm not sure I've run into that, yet. Perhaps that is because our interchanges (with the alliance) have been more informational than anything else, to this point. 08:44:46 PM Amy Sebring:(You have a lot of reality to deal with Burt.) 08:44:55 PM Avagene Moore:There may be some consolation in knowing there are turf problems in those groups also, Burt. 08:45:51 PM Burt Wallrich:Amy, I'm surprised that all the wind you get in CC hasn't blown the nonsense off the table. 08:45:55 PM Amy Sebring:What can clergy bring that nobody else has, besides relief resources? 08:46:09 PM Burt Wallrich:Immediate, trusted presence in the community 08:46:12 PM Amy Sebring:(I wish Burt. It is a struggle, believe me.) 08:46:44 PM Avagene Moore:Burt represents INFO LINE and NERIN. I had never heard of them before going to an AIRS conference last year> These are groups that IAEM needs to partner with, Randy. 08:46:54 PM Amy Sebring:Personal knowledge of their parishoners? 08:46:58 PM Burt Wallrich:A variety of skills in a parish, rather than a single service 08:47:15 PM Amy Sebring:Ken? 08:47:28 PM Burt Wallrich:Real commitment to serve. 08:47:53 PM Amy Sebring:Compassion (I hope) 08:47:55 PM Ken Baechel:Altruism , really 08:48:09 PM Avagene Moore:Love of fellow man. 08:48:23 PM Ken Baechel:A sence of peace 08:48:47 PM Amy Sebring:They have a pulpit. 08:48:54 PM Amy Sebring:(usually) 08:48:56 PM Ken Baechel:Exemplary lives (not always) 08:49:04 PM Amy Sebring:Can they assist with public education? 08:49:18 PM Ken Baechel:Yes good one 08:49:26 PM Burt Wallrich:Ken, exemplary life has been taken off the list of leadership qualities. 08:49:42 PM Amy Sebring:(good one Burt) 08:49:48 PM Ken Baechel:/thank you Mr. President 08:49:48 PM Avagene Moore:In some circles, Burt. 08:49:56 PM Randall Duncan:They (the clergy / church) also represent the first form or organizaed labor to serve a large organization. The church gave us the first model of bureaucracy. 08:50:30 PM Amy Sebring:I think most churches also have supporting organizations ... 08:50:43 PM Ken Baechel:i.e. 08:50:47 PM Amy Sebring:such as women's groups, men's groups, youth groups... 08:50:55 PM Ken Baechel:Yes 08:50:56 PM Amy Sebring:to which the pastor has access. 08:51:06 PM Burt Wallrich:Very important, Amy 08:51:06 PM Amy Sebring:We had such a thing as a prayer circle. 08:51:17 PM Amy Sebring:Do you know what I am referring to? 08:51:22 PM Ken Baechel:They can bring together many resources 08:51:41 PM Amy Sebring:This was a telephone chain. 08:51:50 PM Amy Sebring:A communication network. 08:52:09 PM Ken Baechel:Prayer circles are growing thanks to the internet 08:52:36 PM Amy Sebring:Cannot this network be used to disseminate warning, public info, instructions, etc.? 08:52:51 PM Ken Baechel:Yes 08:53:12 PM Ken Baechel:And quickly 08:53:21 PM Amy Sebring:You should know Ken! 08:53:29 PM Avagene Moore:Having said all this --- a lot of excellent points made --- what does this all mean to us? We have a great resource in the clergy and the churches. Are we channeling that segment of community energy wisely? 08:53:30 PM Burt Wallrich:That can be especially helpful where the parishoners are isolated, e.g., immigrants, disabled, etc. 08:54:05 PM Avagene Moore:Is there work to be done? 08:54:06 PM Randall Duncan:The study of sociology tells us when someone receives a warning, one of the behaviours they exhibit is to confirm from an outside source. That's why it's vitally important all channels of communicatoin should covey the same message in a disaster. 08:54:07 PM Amy Sebring:So, I think we should make sure churches are on our fax list. 08:54:25 PM Amy Sebring:Most of them have these days don't they? 08:54:44 PM Burt Wallrich:Yes, on the fax list and part of the network beforehand. Or the fax won't mean much 08:55:10 PM Avagene Moore:You mean they have to be part of the planning for the community? 08:55:14 PM Ken Baechel:CAN doesn't have one church on any of its lists 08:55:28 PM Burt Wallrich:Yes. Again, in the VOAD or whatever exists in a particular town 08:55:50 PM Randall Duncan:That's absolutely fascinating, Ken. Do you have any speculation as to why there aren't any churches on your service? 08:55:58 PM Ken Baechel:And we have over 2million #'s 08:56:07 PM Amy Sebring:I have been watching the NWS film on NOAA radio over and over lately... 08:56:32 PM Amy Sebring:there is footage of the church in Alabama that got hit by a tornado. 08:56:48 PM Ken Baechel:This is the first discussion of this type I have ever heard of 08:56:49 PM Amy Sebring:I remember when that happened. 08:57:09 PM Amy Sebring:So tragic. Should get warning there as well. 08:57:12 PM Avagene Moore:There were no warnings for the people in that church, Amy. People died there. 08:57:50 PM Amy Sebring:These facilities are being used every day of the week, not just on Sundays. 08:57:50 PM Ken Baechel:NWS kenw 20 + min. in advance 08:58:04 PM Randall Duncan:That "Palm Sunday" incident sparked calls from many of my local churches. We discussed the subject of warning during a worship service. We decided it would be a good thing to have someone monitor NOAA Weather Radio during any gathering in their facilities. 08:58:34 PM Randall Duncan:Many of the churches then bought NOAA weather radio receivers for their facilities. 08:58:53 PM Amy Sebring:Give me a right up on that Randy so I can post! 08:58:59 PM Ken Baechel:It wasn't receivable at that church 08:59:05 PM Amy Sebring:(write up) 08:59:20 PM Burt Wallrich:Suggestion: we have a disaster training for nonprofit managers. It could easily be adapted for church leadership... 08:59:25 PM Amy Sebring:Transmitter coverage is improving Ken. 08:59:41 PM Burt Wallrich:either the leadership in one large church or people from several churches in a community... 08:59:44 PM Ken Baechel:Thank God! 08:59:48 PM Burt Wallrich:If there is interest, let me know. 08:59:50 PM Randall Duncan:You're exactly right, Ken. There wasn't a transmitter in the area. That's when Vice President Gore announced the initiative to fund more transmitters. We have used mitigation 406 funding to add new transmitters here in Kansas. 09:01:05 PM Amy Sebring:One issue with clergy that appeared in our local paper... 09:01:05 PM Ken Baechel:Avagene We Promised 1 hr. 09:01:08 PM Avagene Moore:When I was a local director, I helped several churches write plans for their facilities, including the church I attend. 09:01:15 PM Ken Baechel:What next? 09:01:23 PM Avagene Moore:One last question.... 09:01:29 PM Avagene Moore:how do you vote.... 09:01:40 PM Amy Sebring:has been a chilling effect of lawsuits/liability on counselling in general. 09:01:41 PM Avagene Moore:Should the clergy/churches be part of every communities' resources and planning as we prepare for disasters? 09:01:46 PM Amy Sebring:Is this a real problem. 09:02:24 PM Burt Wallrich:I think I've made my opinion on this clear...Yes! 09:02:26 PM Amy Sebring:We can save that for another time. 09:02:31 PM Avagene Moore:Good question, Amy. I think the liability is a problem. 09:02:35 PM Randall Duncan:My vote is an enthuiastic "Yes!" I think it will be very important to conduct the same type of dialogue with our ministerial alliances that we do with all our other partners. 09:02:54 PM Amy Sebring:How do we get that message out to EM community? 09:03:19 PM Ken Baechel:Yes but perhaps more for theitr physical resources than their spiritual 09:03:21 PM Amy Sebring:I wouldn't expect much from FEMA. 09:03:37 PM Avagene Moore:Ken, Randy, how would you feel about a summary of this discussion in the newsletter? 09:04:06 PM Burt Wallrich:Should this be a workshop at the next NCCEM conference? 09:04:07 PM Ken Baechel:Yes, I'm a good editor 09:04:12 PM Randall Duncan:I certainly don't have any objection to a summary of this conversation in the newsletter. Perhaps this will assist in "sparking" further thoughtful discussion of this topic! 09:04:31 PM Amy Sebring:I think a workshop is a very interesting idea. 09:04:41 PM Ken Baechel:Who is a good author ? 09:04:45 PM Avagene Moore:Burt, a workshop is a good idea. 09:05:00 PM Amy Sebring:We may need also to look for some other clergy who take a particular interest in this. 09:05:03 PM Avagene Moore:Ken, we will have a transcript. Could be the basis for the article. 09:05:15 PM Ken Baechel:Good 09:05:33 PM Avagene Moore:Might send it to Shari and see what she can do with it. 09:05:36 PM Amy Sebring:I for one think that solicitations for donations ($$) should include... 09:05:58 PM Amy Sebring:not only ARC, Salvation Army, but also your local church. 09:06:22 PM Avagene Moore:Yes, might cut out some admin costs. 09:06:54 PM Avagene Moore:Any closing coments folks. This has been great!